A long time business reality is this: Catering Managers, Private Event Managers, and Venue Managers control a disproportionately large amount of referrals to wedding vendors; particularly those that work on the wedding day.
Regardless of their referral policies and procedures, it should go without saying that the relationship between the wedding vendor and venue representative is a most valuable asset.
There are some vendors that do not seem to appreciate this reality and manage to trash that relationship and trust with reckless abandon.
Here is a composite list of just a few reminders that should be committed to memory.
- Defining Late: Technically, you are late if you are not ready when it’s time for the doors to open for an event. In reality, you should be ready 15-30 minutes prior to the scheduled start time, because it is common for guests to arrive early. Wedding receptions do not run by a NASA countdown. Furthermore, different venue managers have their own comfort zone as to how early you should arrive… to set up, to deliver a cake, whatever. Even two different people, at the same property, may prefer different arrival times for you. If one wants you there 60 minutes ahead, for set up, and other, 90 minutes, don’t wasted time convincing them otherwise. Find out who is working the event, and arrive as early as prudent.
- Who is the boss? Who is the client?: Even if the bride has autographed your agreement for services, life is not that simple. As a day-of vendor, you serve the client, and are also a guest at the venue. A guest, in this regard. It is incumbent upon you to know the house guidelines and policies, act professionally, and not usurp the role of being in charge. The fact the bride has asked you to ‘coordinate the event festivities‘, if not communicated by the client to the venue representative, can cause huge problems. You are on someone else’s turf, and right or wrong, unless your working relationship with them dictates otherwise, they may see themselves as ‘in charge’, absolutely.
- Demonstrate Entitlement: From time to time, referrals from a given venue will subside…. or fade to black. Lately, I’ve heard about a number of desperate moves that can only be considered self-destructive. For example, dropping in, unannounced is usually bad move. When it’s explained to you that you are no longer on the referral list, it’s preferable not to bad-mouth the companies that are. Whether your company is, in fact, superior to those on the magic list, insulting them is tantamount to insulting the catering manager. These kinds of referral relationships are fluid and not permanent. It’s necessary to maintain contact and communication, in good times, and in bad, regardless of the flow of referrals.
Trust me… there are more incredibly foolish vendor tricks. Catering and event managers are encouraged to chime in with their own stories.
Andy Ebon
The Wedding Marketing Blog
Great post Andy!
I especially like the part about talking trash about the competition!
Jodi
Great column!
Right on, Andy. Referrals come from helping other people do their jobs. I like to think of venues as my “working partners” – we are all working together to give our clients an amazing event.
Arriving early, while important, is even better when paired with a phone call the week of to confirm the timeline and ask about set up, load in and load out procedures. That 5 minute phone call to introduce yourself, or re-connect with a venue manager is something many people skip.
During the event, show respect to the entire staff and the facility (don’t bash doors or leave trash at your station).
Write Thank You notes after the event (and each time they send a referral) to further show your appreciation.
Jim
Thanks for your comment, Jim.
It really amazes how me how much of this is common sense and communication. Yet, it amazes me even more, how many people completely miss the boat.
Andy
That part is particularly counter-productive. By attempting to trash the competition, one inadvertently is telling the caterer they don’t know what they are doing (otherwise THAT company wouldn’t be on this list).
Really bad strategy…
Andy
As usual Andy you are so, so right! Great post…
Perhaps so, but it’s great to read your affirmation.
Andy
We work with a lot if really wonderful venues. That said, I’d like to tackle the other side of this article briefly…
How a venue can get a bad rap, lose referrals, embarrass themselves, and anger other wedding day vendors:
1 – Act like the wedding is about your venue rather than the bride and groom. Be rigid and inflexible, or worse, “holier than thou” when other vendors are trying to do their job pleasing the bride, groom, and their families.
2 – Try to take charge of the DJ, Band MC, and/or photographer. They view you as part of the team, not management. The clients are “management”. If the bride wants 10 more minutes of photos, or the cake moved out of an obscure corner, or whatever, it’s your job to accommodate her and the others she has hired for her wedding.
3 – This will get you on the black list instantly: Feed the photographer(s) who have been working 8-10 staight hours without a bite by giving them a little “bandwich” in a stryofoam box and leaving them to eat it in a back room (where we’re unavailable to our client) or worse, on some random staircase. Not only is the incredibly classless and cheap, but how can we recommend your food if we don’t get to eat it?
4 – Turn the lights all the way up at 1 minute past the end of the event, roll out the big trash cans, and start treat straglers like trespassers. For what they’ve paid for this special occasion, they should be treated like guests at Disney until they drive away.
5 – An extra tip: when the bar closes at the end of the night put out plenty of water. It’s free. People will appreciate it.
6 – Extra tip 2: Serve dinner to the band, DJ, Videographer, and Photographer at the same time you serve the bride. When she’s done eating, we are too, whether we’ve eaten or not.
We’re all on the same team on wedding day. Let’s all make each other look good, and put the bride and groom first.
Hi Andy,
I find your post very interesting and while I understand where you’re coming from, I can’t help but agree with Wedding Photog on all accounts.
I’m a 7 time award winning event designer and producer, was recently named a finalist as Designer of the Year, and also serve on two Board of Directors for event industry associations, however, despite all those accomplishments, I was recently treated like garbage by the venue manager of the last event I did simply because she “hated event planners”. Before the venue manager even met me, she already told my bride she hated planners and that she shouldn’t even hire one. This person made my life miserable for the several months I had to deal with her, along with making my vendors miserable, and did everything she could to make things difficult for us all, and because of her actions, it affected things negatively for my bride.
I’m not saying every venue is like this and fortunately this was only the second time I’ve got “attitude” from a venue and had to suck it up for the sake of my client –most have been an absolute pleasure to work with–while I respect we are in someone else’s “home” at a venue, truth be told the manager isn’t the owner and really shouldnt act like they own the place (they need to get their egos in check.) We are all here to keep our client’s happy and should work together as a team to make someone’s day special. Due to that person’s acts and actions, not only do I never want to work there again and will NEVER recommend them to my clients or industry colleagues, neither will any of my vendors. So basically the venues also need to be careful the way they treat their vendors, because many of the vendors are very influential in the event industry and also with where we will recommend our clients to book their space. Treat us badly, we will steer our clients elsewhere.
On a side note –most venue and catering managers are taking “referral fees and commissions” (aka: huge cuts) from the vendors to get on their preferred/recommended vendors list, which I personally find despicable that they abuse their privilige as a venue to have the upper hand with vendors. What happened to the days of a hand shake and people wanting to work with each other simply because they believe in their talent and work ethic, and not just because they want a cut of the action? I may be young but I’m old school in that respect.
There is a new generation of event professionals emerging and we’re not gonna take the abuse any longer!
Let’s all play nice in the sandbox, let’s all make each other look good to our clients, and let’s all be on the same team to create an amazing event!
Best regards,
Christine Brower
C. Brower & Co Creative Events
Award Winning Event Design & Production
http://www.cbrowerandco.com
Brower Power!
Hi Andy,
Yikes! Those last two vendors must have really been burned. They seem very bitter about how they were treated.
I am a venue owner. We’ve always treated the outside vendors with the respect they deserve. That being said, If a vendor (no matter who it is) is doing something that is against policy or is irritating the staff or guests, I will let them know directly. Yes, this is my house. Whether or not they are referred by me in the future depends on the way they handle the discussion…
It’s very obvious to me that the above no named photographer has never been a venue owner or manager. The venue/catering staff starts their day long before the other vendors do and it continues long past the end of the event. When the event is over, it’s over. I don’t agree with dragging out the garbage cans or treating guests rudely, but turning up the lights is a universally understood sign that it’s time to go…party’s over. I do agreee there should always be ample water available for the guests, right up until the end of the event.
As to feeding the vendors…we have always fed the DJ/Band and Photographer/videographers on our dime. They eat whatever the B&G and their guests are eating. They will be last through the buffet line/served and eat on the covered veranda attached to the ballroom (not hidden from their clients) unless the Bride & Groom have counted them as invited guests. Usually unless they are family, they are paid employees and will not be eating in the ballroom with the guests…not here anyway. We also feed our waitstaff (paid employees)…should they sit with the guests in the ballroom and eat? I think not. That would be very unprofessional indeed.
If a caterer has any integrity, they’ll want to serve dinner on time. Not just because it will throw off the rest of the evening if it’s late, but some venues actually prepare the food minutes before it’s to be served (as we do) as to preserve the presentation. Maybe he/she should consider the caterer’s point of view on taking an extra 10 minutes for photos. Afterall, are they not trying to do the best job possible for their client as well by sticking to the timeline ? Could there not be a hundred other photo opportunity’s that evening ? Hopefully…
Although I include all planning and wedding direction in my packages, I do not disallow outside planners. I’ve had very few brides book with us and use an outside planner. Being that I include that service…I don’t get referrals from area planners…understandably. No worries, it doesn’t affect our business in the least.
There are plenty of vendors in every category in most places and things can get very competitive.
If you’re truly good at what you do, you’ll be busy. Venue referrals or not…
~Melissa Cogliati
Owner/Event Planner
Everyone’s entitled to their opinion…
Melissa,
Thanks for your thoughtful comments.
Speaking from the personal experience of almost 1000 weddings (as a DJ Entertainer), it is sad to say that you are an exception on many counts. In part, that’s because you are an owner.
At larger hotels, it’s not unusual for the client and day-of-vendors to only deal with the Banquet Manager. The Catering Sales Manager has turned over the event and is not present at all. Or, they are present until the meal is server, and depart shortly thereafter.
All too many venues do not appreciate/understand that including entertainer/photographer/videographer for the meal (whether paid by the client or not) is wise on multiple counts. All of them have work days that far exceed the time at the reception, and need the meal just for normal health and energy. It’s wise to have them, present, in the reception room (not some special OTHER place for THE HELP) so that they do not, inadvertently, miss any photo opp or other unscheduled announcement. Even keeping the volume at a comfortable level is an advantage of being ‘on seen.’
I know of hotels that ‘forbid’ these professionals from eating, even if their agreement with the client dictates it. This is the height of both arrogance and cluelessness.
What is interesting to me, is that you are doing everything right (in my opinion). It is shocking to you, but not to me, that vendors are treated poorly, frequently. The reverse is also true. Some vendors have little appreciation of the team element, when performing their service.
It certainly cut both ways.
Andy
Andy,
Thanks for your last post on the topic. I couldn’t have said it better myself.
Alex Vaughan
Alex Vaughan Mobile Entertainment
Dover, Delaware
Melissa
I’ll have to disagree with you on several comments.
” We’ve always treated the outside vendors with the respect they deserve. ”
That should say “with respect” final, period.
“they deserve” implies that you limit the amount of respect to a level you deem they warrant.
Yes, the catering staff has a long day, but so do the photo and video crew. We usually have a 10 hr for a one location event and I’ve had many 16 hr days where I’ve had to go to the groom’s house, bride’s house, church and park before entering the catering hall’s door. Which, BTW, should not have to be the kitchen.
We should be fed in the room or immediately adjacent to it in case something unscheduled happens.
There have been many times in my career when a caterer has come running into the room where they sent me to eat, halfway across the building, to tell me that a guest decided to get up and propose a toast or sing. Usually too late, and to add insult to injury I’ve gone back to finish my meal only to find that my dinner had been cleared.
I have been told by hotel and country club managers that I wasn’t being fed, not to eat during the cocktail hour and not to go to the bar for a soda only to watch them throwing away huge amount of food at the end of the cocktail hour.
And while I’m on a roll, let me throw in a word about catering halls who tell prospective brides that they can have photos taken all over the facility only to tell me on the day of the affair that I’m limited to one location because there are other parties going on. Especially those places that have designated areas assigned to specific rooms in the venue.
On timing, if the everyone in the wedding party is cooperative and on time, my brides are finished with photos 1/2 at least before you’ll need them. If I ask for ten more minutes, it’s because someone in the family is late or missing and ten minutes now means I won’t have to pull them out of the party for 1/2 hour later.
Caterers need to remember that their responsibility to the client ends at the end of the party and the photographers responsibility has only just started.
Brilliant framed argument.
Andy
As a DJ/MC/sound tech/light tech/dance instructor/event planner/event coordinator/psychologist/public speaker/motivator and friend of B&G (I spend alot time getting to know my clients), I try not to be offended when I am TOLD that I HAVE to set up ALL my equipment in the corner or behind a column just because that’s where “all the other” DJs set up. Because when the B&G show up, and I’m not set up the way we planned, I quietly explain what transpired and assure them that I will “do what it takes”. Now the B&G aren’t happy. They remember that stuff when it’s time for them to write a reference for the venue!
As far as eating, I do not ask nor do I assume, but if B&G offer, I eat. I do not eat with the other guests. Nor will I eat away from guests. I eat behind my equipment. I invite photogs/viddys to join me. If management gets snippy with me, I explain that I have a job to do and I can not do it from another room.
If I am treated badly by venue management, and I have dealt with arrogant managers and owners, I steer clear of that venue. No referrals from me! However, these are few and far between. Most of the venues I have worked have always been very accommodating. Besides, if vendors contact the coordinator and/or room captain before and gain rapport, they then will have an easier time.
During and after the event, I always get feedback from the venue staff, especially management. They see tons of vendors and can offer great advice or comparisons. If I do a great job, they will ask me for more info about my services. Follow up and discuss their “prefered vendor list”. How do I get on it? Who else is on it? But I will never “pay” to be on that list. I want to be on the list because I deserve to be there.
My2cents.